This is it. The ground floor member of the Joel Waters trio. Mr. Ben Crane! Anyways, when I was writing out all these questions to ask people, the topic of the importance of the bass player came into my head first immediately. I think there is probably a good reason for that. 

I know you started playing electric first, what made you want to get into playing the upright bass? 

 

I guess there was the social pressure, because if you’re involved in the Jazz world and you’re playing in the traditional way, people would book any upright bassist over someone who was amazing at electric. Also, the music - I was listening to a lot of music with double bass in it, and I wanted to get involved with that sonically. It didn’t even need to be stated, it was just what I had to do. Electric bass can work, but why eat sandwiches with no butter? Put that on a plaque.

 

Let's talk about different bass players, and their sound. This is something I've noticed from listening to records, but especially playing long to drumless records. You can really tell when Christian McBride is playing, but then you can really hear when it’s someone like Dave Holland playing. Both killing, but two very different sounds. What do you like about certain bass players' sounds, how they achieve that technique, and the process of recording bass through the evolution of Jazz?

 

Interesting. Bass is different to the sax, where you put a microphone in front of it and it sounds like a saxophone. Obviously there are a million different ways you can record, but a lot of old records the bass doesn’t always cut through. For a long time it was about producing volume and being heard at the expense of everything else. The NHOP type sound that really came about in the 70s/80s with Ron Carter as well, the very pickup-y sound, it’s hard for a lot of people to like, but it’s got a certain aesthetic that is quite cool. However most people, including myself prefer how a double bass would sound in a room. For me, the way Christian McBride records his sound is how a double bass sound should be. It all comes from basso continuo in the old days, where a bass line is helping you guide your ear to whatever the harmony is. It’s trying to help move you, some bass lines work better than others, but a lot of these bass lines are timeless. There are a lot of bass line rules that don’t really get broken either, beat 1 is reserved for the tonic of the chord, if a new chord starts that bar, then the tonic starts on beat one. Even the most abstract players like Charlie Haden still have those rules under their belt. 80% of the time when a bass player plays the third on the root of a chord, the next two notes will be five, then one. Scott LeFaro (Played with Bill Evans) took the bass to a whole new level and he was playing very abstract, but was totally outlining the harmony all the time. The more I play, the fundamentals become more apparent. 

 

Let's talk about Scott LeFaro then.

 

There were guys before him that were amazing, but Scott took it to that virtuosic playing level. He was really interesting because he played with this amazing sound, but was still so agile. Obviously Paul Chambers was amazing as well, but technically - Scott was something else. His sound was so strong, clear and meaty whilst he was dancing over the whole thing. It’s similar to McBride, whereas I think now other players have compromised that. I’m not cussing out people who aren’t like that though! They’ve all mastered the fundamentals. If you follow what you are interested in, you will soon realise that it all comes back to the fundamentals. 

 

How would you say you have developed your own sound?

 

Recently I have been trying to get more of the emotional intention thing, understanding how the music feels. McBride is so driving, and to incorporate that feeling when needed. Also, figuring out how to come at playing the bass physically, being aware of what I’m playing and how I am changing the sound. In the same way that the shape of a sax players mouth is going to dictate what they will sound like. It’s about having the sound in your head, and trying to replicate that. 

 

An interesting thing James Maddren spoke about to me, was that your technical ability should always be one step of your musicality. I know for me, whenever I try to pick up your bass is such a physically challenging and demanding thing. I know what I want to sound like when I pick up your bass but I won’t sound anything like that because I don’t have a clue about technique! 

 

It’s the same as anything, you can do it - but you have to put in the hours to refine it. A lot of the time I will be hearing something, and not able to play it - especially if I am not warmed up. You have to develop a relaxed steady focus. 

 

From a bass player's perspective, what do you enjoy and not enjoy in a drummer's playing?

 

I love it when drummers, and anyone in the band really shape the music. Taking responsibility for keeping the music moving. Not slowing down, and having their priorities being making the music feel good and exciting. 

Blend is also really important. Mixing yourself in a live setting - if everyone plays as loud as they can without any technological help, all you are going to hear is drums and the horn player. Sometimes drummers can hit it too hard, although you have to learn when to be sensitive, and when the drums need to be whacked! 

 

If a drummer was heading into their first year of music college, what would you advise them to practise?

 

Play along to records, listen and learn. Most importantly, inject as much fun into playing the music. When playing a long to record, try and feel it at an emotional level. Work on metronome practise as well, not to quantise your mind completely, but record yourself, playing with the metronome on the second semiquaver of every bar or something, see if you are always rushing or dragging. Be aware of what your weaknesses are. Don’t rush fills and breathe! 
 

As a bassist, how do you try to imitate other bass players? For example, the weight of the beat, skip beats, different feels. 

 

I play along with records. Play for four bars, listen for four bars, then try to imitate the placement of the bass players beat. I’ve also transcribed bass lines as well.

 

Which bass players have you transcribed their bass lines?

 

I’ve done some Paul Chambers, Scott LeFaro, Israel Crosby - from But Not For Me on the Perishing records. There are some really nice bass lines in that. Listen and try to get involved in what they are doing. It’s deceptively simple, but if you are doing it mindlessly it can feel pointless. If you are switched on whilst you’re doing it, then it is really useful. 

How would you answer your own question?

 

How Do I imitate other drummers? The first thing is listen to the drummer obsessively, and then listen to the records so much to the point where I can easily tell if it’s Max, Philly or whoever. Then I transcribe their solos, time and comping. Then I will go on a massive YouTube binge, and try to find as many videos of them playing as possible. I will watch and listen, listening to how they interact with the band musically. Then I will get on the drums, shut my eyes and pretend that I am them. Speaking of non Jazz drummers, I used to always try to pretend to be playing like Thomas Pridgen, because I find that technically he is really satisfying to watch. Brian Blade is the hardest for me to try to play. You can transcribe Brian, but you have to really study his movements, and figure out why he is making the sound that he is. That doesn’t mean that technically he is the best drummer, but it’s trying to tap into their mindset. I guess with playing bass, because the instrument is so big you can’t move as much. I will always try to be technically proficient, but i think it’s kind of cool to try and move like Elvin. I know that at the end of the day though I will always sound like myself. 

I remember when I had a chance to play with Pablo Held, I wanted to feel like Jorge Rossy, or one of those contemporary drummers. I felt like a different drummer when I was playing with him, it was incredible! The way he was playing, was making me play very differently. If you listen to such a vast majority of music you realise there isn’t just one way to go ding ding ga ding. There are a thousand ways to make it sound different! Anyways, I listened back to the record of me playing with Pablo, and I realised I just sounded like me. It was a bit of a come down if i’m honest, he probably just thought he was playing with any bog standard college kids. But I was still playing all the same phrases I was practising the day before. There’s an interesting quote John Mayer said ‘You get your sound from failing to sound like the people you want to sound like’. That hit me.

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Yes that’s the thing. You can have ideals, and you’ll always try to play like them, but you will never sound as John Coltrane, no matter how hard you try. It’s great to try it and put on different hats, same as the process of acquiring language. Babies are just looking at other peoples mouths, hearing sounds, and trying to do the same thing, but falling short of what is happening around them. Then that allows you to develop into your own entity. Your personality will always shine through. 

 

Well I am very much looking forward to playing eventually when all of this is over. I think our gigs have been cancelled for now, but hopefully we can play soon. Thank you for your time!